Silly?

[AFKAEjay]

I’ve always marched on “only one digital device, combining them is overcomplicating stuff”.
I recently switched to the QC (from kp), with its number of switches/IOs in a small package as a main driver for that, but not over the moon with its time efx.
Added a Halo delay cause “dual delay with crossfeedback” is “my thing”…and not the QCs
Atm not super enthousiastic about the verbs…it’s not that I need something exotic…but I don’t think they sound as musical as the Kempers for example.
I could become a rockgod with the current setup and be happy with it, QC and the halo in the loop”, but YOLO steers my mind to this:

The ratio:
- QC will probably update its efx overtime…but it’s not realistic that they will ever get it on the level of eventide ever…simply cause that’s eventides core game, with a very long history of expertise that is not likely to be overhauled by any of the modeler manufacturers…so if I appreciate what it offers, it’s a good investment in the long run. (And I don’t have to eat less peanut butter on my sandwich if I get this)
- Kemper has efx I like, but they are not likely to offer a formfactor I like in the coming years
- I expect FAS to have time efx I’m happy with, but fm3 has to little switches, FM9 is a bit more real estate still then QC+H90..and less suitable for the scenario that I get weird again and want to add analog pedals.
- With Eventide I get the Ferrari of time efx…their presets might trigger some unexpected creative choices
- I still have a board that fits a gigbag…if I add a satellite with expression pedals for times I need wah.

What you all think?

 

[molul]

Tough question. If you're unhappy with the QC you should definitely add whatever you think it may work.

I really hope the QC form factor is addressed by other brands in the near future. I think there's a market demanding Kemper, Helix and Fractal products with the QC size.

 

[laxu]

I think the issues with the QC + H90 setup would be:

• Increased latency. This could push the latency to a place you don't like. Even more so in case you want to use wireless with it. My understanding is that the H90 does not do analog dry-through.
• Cost. I don't know about US pricing but it would cost me 2739 € for both devices. That's FM9 or used Axe-Fx 3 money. The board you have there is not that much smaller than a FM9.
• Working with the H90 might get annoying over time. It's dated for such a new device, and clearly designed around using the editor.

This video, timestamped, shows what the onboard parameter editing is going to be like:


You can live with that, but it's never going to be very enjoyable for the same reasons I don't like using the HX Stomp compared to the full Helix. Just lots of paging and poor visibility to the overall parameter set. The editor is a going to be a better experience but then you need to connect it via USB cable afaik.

Eventide has clearly put a lot of thought into giving you options when you have a preset built up how you like and then want to tweak it just a little by e.g the hot knob assignments, but not so fun when you want to adjust a lot of things.

I can totally symphatize with your issue though. The QC form factor is fantastic, the onboard UI is very nice, but the fx quality left me wanting too. Drives, amps and cabs are easy to replace with captures and custom IRs but you can't do anything about the fx other than add outboard gear.

I really hope for next gen Line6/Fractal/Boss we get some goldilocks product. For current gen I feel the Helix Floor is the closest (sounds good, tons of features, relatively easy to use) but there's nothing quite like that in a more compact form factor.

QC could have been it but NDSP has focused on totally wrong aspects due to pressure from users to fullfill their initial promises. I really hope after the plugin update they can ramp up work on more effects or improving existing ones.

 

[Sedaxel]

I feel like you. So many times trying things and ending up "meh... An all-in-one unit is, again, more convenient".

That new pedalboard you're planning is just the same for me. It complicates everything... Editing, communicating between them, latency... And I'm not really sure about that "it still fits in a gigbab" affirmation. Actually, I'm pretty sure a Kemper Stage is similar, if not easier to carry around (no support pedalboard, no power supplies, no cables).

Honestly, in terms of convenience, I see the Stage MUCH better than building a "QC+anything" board.

But... If you're like me, you'll have fun playing around with the project, you'll spend money (much money) and then you'll disassemble it and try another thing. It never ends.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[AFKAEjay]

I’m not to worried about latency…cause for my core sounds I would be running verbs and delay on the h90, which i would do in a parallel loop

 

[TubeStack]

I found myself adding the Stomp to the QC, then switching to an HX One, largely for the delays as well.

It was cool and fun, but also kind of a pain, and I ultimately ended up with a Helix Floor and am still happy with it.

 

[molul]

Helix Floor/LT or Kemper Stage indeed seem a better option than this combination. Single unit, easier editing...

I've had multieffects+external pedals a couple of times in my life. Nothing feels better than having a single device with, probably not 100% all you need, but easily 90%.

Also, forcing myself to stop using certain pedals, led me to discovering very cool stuff in my multieffects.

 

[AFKAEjay]

I feel like you. So many times trying things and ending up "meh... An all-in-one unit is, again, more convenient".

That new pedalboard you're planning is just the same for me. It complicates everything... Editing, communicating between them, latency... And I'm not really sure about that "it still fits in a gigbab" affirmation. Actually, I'm pretty sure a Kemper Stage is similar, if not easier to carry around (no support pedalboard, no power supplies, no cables).

Honestly, in terms of convenience, I see the Stage MUCH better than building a "QC+anything" board.

But... If you're like me, you'll have fun playing around with the project, you'll spend money (much money) and then you'll disassemble it and try another thing. It never ends.

Just my 2 cents.

My current fits in my gigbag…which is a tad bigger than the one I’m aiming for. I got a bigass gigbag..,and/or..a dual gigbag if all else fails

Stage and also FM have been in scope…but I made the choice for QC…still happy with that…and regardless, I’m gonna stick to that decision for a while…GT core I used as a “gigbagrig” has been sold, kpa toaster is close to be put online. I’m not really a switcher when it comes to modelers…kemper has been my main for 8 years?…GT core was with me for 4 years probably.

So 2 scenarios:
- add the H90
- stay with my current board, I could be very happy with that…it’s the 3% extra YOLO reverbs and whatever eventide brings I’d would not give myself as a present

 

[JiveTurkey]

My current fits in my gigbag…which is a tad bigger than the one I’m aiming for. I got a bigass gigbag..,and/or..a dual gigbag if all else fails

View attachment 23045
Stage and also FM have been in scope…but I made the choice for QC…still happy with that…and regardless, I’m gonna stick to that decision for a while…GT core I used as a “gigbagrig” has been sold, kpa toaster is close to be put online. I’m not really a switcher when it comes to modelers…kemper has been my main for 8 years?…GT core was with me for 4 years probably.

So 2 scenarios:
- add the H90
- stay with my current board, I could be very happy with that…it’s the 3% extra YOLO reverbs and whatever eventide brings I’d would not give myself as a present

Slick rig right here! That midi controller looks awesome!

 

[AFKAEjay]

I think the issues with the QC + H90 setup would be:

• Increased latency. This could push the latency to a place you don't like. Even more so in case you want to use wireless with it. My understanding is that the H90 does not do analog dry-through.
• Cost. I don't know about US pricing but it would cost me 2739 € for both devices. That's FM9 or used Axe-Fx 3 money. The board you have there is not that much smaller than a FM9.
• Working with the H90 might get annoying over time. It's dated for such a new device, and clearly designed around using the editor.

This video, timestamped, shows what the onboard parameter editing is going to be like:


You can live with that, but it's never going to be very enjoyable for the same reasons I don't like using the HX Stomp compared to the full Helix. Just lots of paging and poor visibility to the overall parameter set. The editor is a going to be a better experience but then you need to connect it via USB cable afaik.

Eventide has clearly put a lot of thought into giving you options when you have a preset built up how you like and then want to tweak it just a little by e.g the hot knob assignments, but not so fun when you want to adjust a lot of things.

I can totally symphatize with your issue though. The QC form factor is fantastic, the onboard UI is very nice, but the fx quality left me wanting too. Drives, amps and cabs are easy to replace with captures and custom IRs but you can't do anything about the fx other than add outboard gear.

I really hope for next gen Line6/Fractal/Boss we get some goldilocks product. For current gen I feel the Helix Floor is the closest (sounds good, tons of features, relatively easy to use) but there's nothing quite like that in a more compact form factor.

QC could have been it but NDSP has focused on totally wrong aspects due to pressure from users to fullfill their initial promises. I really hope after the plugin update they can ramp up work on more effects or improving existing ones.

I’m not too worried about the UI. I’m not a hardcore tweaker. I do appriciate quick access to stuff you adjust at a gig…and that’s all handled by the QC. Costs..yeah..it’s not the cheapest solution, but if it puts a smile on my face for a couple of years I’m ok with that.
Other units not on the table atm. L6 never was tbh, to big of a unit, and the encounters I had with their time efx didn’t spark much enthousiasme tbh…seems like their audio engineers have different taste then me, which is fine, nothing fits everybody

 

[AFKAEjay]

Slick rig right here! That midi controller looks awesome!

Yeah…that’s a great unit. For this rig the switches basically replace expression pedals (increase/decrease cc values) controlling wet/dry on the Halo, and volume on the QC.
It’s a startup with a very active dev, adds stuff like a madman ..and….it comes with small remote controllers you can stick to your guitar..which actually work
Check the Luminite thread in this section.
Quite affordable for what you get also.

 

[Aleksi]

As an outboard effects with Fractal kind of guy (noooooooooo, but isn't Fractal the absolute best at everything???? HOW COULD YOU) I will say that awesome gear is awesome and if you can afford it and it makes sense to you, go nuts. I'm a reverb nut and I prefer some of the algorithms in the H90 to the ones in the FM3, and the Meris Mercury X makes me even happier in my enormous, reverberant pants. The Eventide hall can sound very vocal and beautiful and is currently my favourite on there. I don't really like the presets and I took several weeks to make my own. Not everything in your rig has to be perfectly sensible and reasonable.

 

[ragingplatypi]

The thing I’m learning by using multiple units is I hate dealing with routing and leveling. I’m so spoiled by having experienced multiple paths inside one box.

 

[came the rain]

 

[namathan_zirwir]

I thought about adding an H90 to my QC, but went with an HX Effects instead. I just liked the extra onboard switches the HX has.
The H90 is a great unit and that looks like it would be a killer rig!

 

[la szum]

Don't multiple digital devices in the signal path increase the number of A/D/A conversions going on
and accumulate more latency with each added device?? Especially if there is no analog dry thru, and
they end up adding latency even when not "on," but in the chain.

 

[Aleksi]

Don't multiple digital devices in the signal path increase the number of A/D/A conversions going on
and accumulate more latency with each added device?? Especially if there is no analog dry thru, and
they end up adding latency even when not "on," but in the chain.

You can run a reverb 100% wet on a parallel path absolutely no effect on dry signal latency. On a QC you want to avoid the fx loop blocks because they add latency to the entire signal. Separate send/return blocks don't.

Also, I've done some blind testing on myself and latency has to be prettty high for me to reliably be able to tell the difference. Some people may be more sensitive.

 

[laxu]

Don't multiple digital devices in the signal path increase the number of A/D/A conversions going on
and accumulate more latency with each added device?? Especially if there is no analog dry thru, and
they end up adding latency even when not "on," but in the chain.

The AD conversion is IMO inconsequential but the latency is certainly a thing.

 

[Whizzinby]

 

[Whizzinby]

I ran my QC with an HXFX without any issues